Hand position, stance, punch

fredyT
Junior Member

Posts: 5

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 11, 2011 19:31:38 GMT

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Post by fredyT on Apr 11, 2011 19:31:38 GMT

I know there are many opinions on my next question(s) and I am interested to hear yours. I am having a discussion with other coaches in our youth organization around these.

When in the three point stance where do you have your players put their non-down hand? Do they put it in behind the knee, do you have them hold it out in front?

On first step, do you have your players load their hands (get them in their holsters, hands drawn back to hips). Do you not have them load, if not where do the hands go?

Do you have them punch on second step (the second step wins I have read in Coach Campbell's materials)

Last question is the punch. I like the thumbs up punch with the heal of the hand and get to the plate for control. How do you teach the punch?

Thanks

Newt21
Member

Posts: 53

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 12, 2011 6:46:45 GMT

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Post by Newt21 on Apr 12, 2011 6:46:45 GMT

Here is how I do it, I'm not saying its right but it is the way I believe in.

Stance: I have their off arm up and ready with their elbow inside the knee (to gain inside leverage). I have players fire their hands on the first step, there usually isn't time to actually load the arms and then fire them if the players both fire out of their stance like they are supposed to.

The way they punch depends on the type of block. On a normal base block I have them fire their palms into the other player's numbers with thumbs up. If it is a down block, I have them fire their playside hand into the chest plate as before, but the backside arm I have them use their forearm to wash the player down the line of scrimmage (this way they have a more solid/controlling surface with which to push with). As I said, I'm not saying its right, but this is what my kids have success with.

Nick Medinger
Head Coach
C.C. Griffin Middle School

Games are won during the season, Championships are won in the off-season.

jrkelly
Senior Member

Posts: 820

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 12, 2011 7:22:03 GMT

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Post by jrkelly on Apr 12, 2011 7:22:03 GMT

I personally do not teach the kids "where" to have their hand in their stance. They will figure that out. I teach them about limiting movement, though. As coach said...if you are having trouble "loading" your hands back, then get them loaded earlier. The only thing I really worry about with stances is that they are solid, balanced stances that the kids can move out of quickly and deliver a blow. The only thing I don't want is to see them resting their off hand on their knee.

Ryan Kelly
Offensive Coordinator
Austin High School
Austin, MN

There is nothing that will show a man's true character like the 2 yard line.

soonerj355alan
Junior Member

Posts: 14

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 12, 2011 10:38:16 GMT

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Post by soonerj355alan on Apr 12, 2011 10:38:16 GMT

Here is what I teach:

When we break the huddle, line goes up and gets splits and feet set then puts both elbows inside knees with hands clasped in front. On down command (whatever you use) they unclasp and put one hand down keeping other arm in same position as before. This keeps their hands inside and keeps the off hand close to the chest to get to the "loaded" position quickly. I want them relaxed with that hand because if they are too rigid they are more likely to move it in reaction to the defense and false start (only two false starts all year last year).

As far as when to punch, I think punching on the second step is best. If you punch on the first step it seems to me like it would lead to linemen getting overextended and off balance. I teach to take the proper first step, quick load the hands together at chest, and punch with the second step which should even your base up and give you more power. My steps are tap, tap the first two no more than six inches so they happen quick and punch happens pretty quick plus it gets the feet moving quickly on the drive to finish the block.

As for the punch, I teach them on most blocks to hit their landmarks by hitting the heel of their palms together with the thumbs up and follow through. This almost makes sure that they have their hands inside the defenses hands. We like to have their facemask make contact first and for the hands to follow to keep from getting overextended. But different blocks determine slightly different punches.

This is what I teach and have had great success with the last few years. Just one way to skin the cat.

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.

Oneback
Senior Member

EMAIL: billmountjoy@yahoo.com

Posts: 6,223

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 12, 2011 13:22:29 GMT

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Post by Oneback on Apr 12, 2011 13:22:29 GMT

This may not answer ALL your questions - but it is what we stress:

I. BLOCKING FUNDAMENTALS

STANCE:

Explosive and balanced to enable the blocker to move in four (4) directions with vertical leverage. Eyes are up (strain thru the eyebrows).

LANDMARK:

Point of aim, target. Area on defender to place the hands and direct the feet.

LEVERAGE:

A. Vertical: Pad under pad (PUP)
B. Horizontal: Lateral

FOOTWORK: (Step at landmark with vertical leverage).

A. First step = directional; playside — 6" step — step at the landmark. Adjust your first step to the horizontal alignment of the defender (I.E. width and depth).
B. Second step = quickness to get this step down to create power and suddenness.

HAND PLACEMENT:

Thumbs up with the elbows in tight to your framework.

FINISH!!!!!

*****************************************************

II. BASE DRIVE BLOCK

PURPOSE:

A) Used at the P.O.A.
B) 1 on 1 block.
C) Take defender where he wants to go.
D) Get movement — sustain.
E) Back — option run.

1. Explode out.

2. Short first step (1/2 way to fingers of down hand; knee rolls over toe — NOT behind).

3. Back flat.

4. Bull neck.

5. Proper aiming point (aim face at throat of DLM; base of #'s of LB). Look the block in.

6. Second step MUST be beyond first step to win. Make contact on second step (most important step). Hit 1 yard through defender.

7. Whip the arms.

8. Blocking surface (drive the elbows inside & make contact with a triangle of hat & hands (thumbs up) to a lockout; contact the short ribs & "lift him out of his socks" on a 45 degree angle with fork lift motion.

9. Shoot the hips (unlock the power).

10. Driving steps.

11. Feet under you — good base.

12. Maintain contact.

13. 2nd & 3rd effort.

QUESTION: When do you whip the defender?
ANSWER: When he tries to escape the block — you come alive and finish (STAY ON BLOCK).

Bill Mountjoy

znale Junior Member Posts: 1	Hand position, stance, punch Apr 23, 2011 18:57:42 GMT Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by znale on Apr 23, 2011 18:57:42 GMT We always punch on the second step... Also acts as a timing mechanism when we "bird dog" all of the steps in practice. We also make sure to emphasize players "keeping their eyes on their hands" after contact. Helps keep them centered.
	-Zach

WU Bulldog OL Coach
Junior Member

Posts: 11

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 25, 2011 11:39:50 GMT

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Post by WU Bulldog OL Coach on Apr 25, 2011 11:39:50 GMT

WE USED TO PUNCH ON THE SECOND STEP MUCH LIKE EVERYONE ELSE BUT NOW I TEACH PUNCHING ON THE FIRST STEP AND GETTING YOUR HANDS INSIDE OF THE DEFENDER. ON THE COLLEGE LEVEL AND NOW EVEN IN HIGH SCHOOL ....DEF. LINE COACHES ARE TEACHING MARTIAL ARTS TYPE MOVEMENTS TO THEIR DLINEMEN AND IF WE DO NOT GET OUR HANDS INSIDE QUICKLY AND DO AN UP SWING MOVEMENT WITH OUR HANDS AND ARMS....WE WILL USUALLY LOSE THE WAR! YOU CAN GO TO www.hawgtuff.net TO SEE THE PUNCH DRILLS THAT WE USE IN TEACHING THE PUNCH. I LOVE THE STRENGTH BANKS FOR PUNCHING ON THE RUN AND PASS BLOCKING. MUSCLEDRIVERUSA.COM HAS A GREAT DEAL ON THESE BANDS. GO TO THEIR SITE AND SEE HOW CHEAP THEY ARE.

"QUIT TALKING.....LET'S PLAY BALL!'

Coach Campbell Forum Owners Welcome to JCFB.com website and Forum Posts: 7,957	Hand position, stance, punch Apr 27, 2011 8:32:10 GMT Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Coach Campbell on Apr 27, 2011 8:32:10 GMT Coach I have been teach first step punch for sometime because of the reasons you mentioned. Its who can get their hands on the other the fastest wins. Coach Campbell

Oneback
Senior Member

EMAIL: billmountjoy@yahoo.com

Posts: 6,223

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 28, 2011 7:27:38 GMT

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Post by Oneback on Apr 28, 2011 7:27:38 GMT

A lot depends on how deep vertically you set your O-Line OFF the ball. For zone blocking purposes - we like our line as far off the ball as legal (a la Alex Gibbs). That way - you cock on the first step & punch on the second (for MAXIMUM arm thrust).

Here is what the World Champion Packers teach (one of my former players is on their coaching staff):

FOUR CRITICAL ELEMENTS IN RUN BLOCKING:

1. Eyes on the aiming point (speed to the target is ESSENTIAL)

2. Establish leverage (your pads lower than defender's)

3. Elbows in. If they are in tight your hands will be in the right place. Keep hands low - not on top part of defender's pads.

4. Drive your backside knee. Knees must come under your armpit. Drive the backside knee and follow with the play side foot.

NOTE: They believe that #1 & #4 are the MOST IMPORTANT!

Bill Mountjoy

GCTIGERS57
Senior Member

Posts: 506

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 29, 2011 11:31:08 GMT

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Post by GCTIGERS57 on Apr 29, 2011 11:31:08 GMT

As stated above, we try to line up as far off the ball as possible. I use to coach wing-t for years and being off the ball helped out with our angle blocking. Now Im in the spread and we still keep our guys off the LOS as far as we can get them. We are inside and outside zone, power and counter....... 99% of the time so our guys are always stepping at different angles. Our FIRST step is a 6 inch position step and we do cock our elbows and hope to engage contact with the SECOND step. In my drills, I am always talking about Step, Fit, and Drive. Its a progression, one at a time.

JFLCOACH
Member

Posts: 151

Hand position, stance, punch Apr 30, 2011 19:16:23 GMT

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Post by JFLCOACH on Apr 30, 2011 19:16:23 GMT

A lot of good information here. Reality is that these days you really want to stress making contact first, so I want hands on the defender as soon as possible! Now as Jerry and Bill point out technique is important so, to me at least, the key is getting their feet to follow their hands just as quickly. The second step dictates how well you can maintain your position and deliver the block. As much as possible I want my OL to have the dominant hand position, that means inside the defenders arm pits at the numbers. Once you get outside that spot you have lost the leverage and risk a holding call.

Another poster is correct I do teach hand fighting to my DL simply because I want them to get dominant hand position on the OL. Hard as hell to get leverage for a bull rush if my hands are on you shoulders. Hard as hell to rip to my gap when I'm being taken down the LOS with an arm on my chest and forearm driving my shoulder into my ear. Its not all about strictly using hands or shoulders its about using everything at your disposal to get leverage and use it.

Its not about how much YOU know about the game, its about how much you share that knowledge with the people around you.

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Concordia University Irvine

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Post by fredyT on Apr 11, 2011 19:31:38 GMT

Post by Newt21 on Apr 12, 2011 6:46:45 GMT

Post by jrkelly on Apr 12, 2011 7:22:03 GMT

Post by soonerj355alan on Apr 12, 2011 10:38:16 GMT

Post by Oneback on Apr 12, 2011 13:22:29 GMT

Post by znale on Apr 23, 2011 18:57:42 GMT

Post by WU Bulldog OL Coach on Apr 25, 2011 11:39:50 GMT

Post by Coach Campbell on Apr 27, 2011 8:32:10 GMT

Post by Oneback on Apr 28, 2011 7:27:38 GMT

Post by GCTIGERS57 on Apr 29, 2011 11:31:08 GMT

Post by JFLCOACH on Apr 30, 2011 19:16:23 GMT

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