Question on Inside Veer

Chuck,

No way. On the ISV we read the down tackle in a 50 (4i-4-5 tech) and block the DE. Verses a 40 look, we read the first man outside the B gap which is the rule that is applicable to all veer option and in a college 4-3 usually is the DE that they call OLB's. If it is a pull we get up field to our next read who is the DE vs. the 50. DE CAN ONLY DO THREE THINGS TO A QB. 1. play hard and crash right now forcing the QB to pitch. 2. He can play slow and string it out. 3. He can go directly to pitch.

If we have him blocked, QB keeps and pitches off the SS or Corner while the RB has cut up with him to maintain the proper pitch relationship.

On the OSV he is not blocked of course and the 3 things listed is still all he can do to your QB!

Coach Easton

TIGER--We do exactly that on OSV, option the DE. It has been a deadly play for us...not so much in 2004 but in 2002-2003 b/c we had a fast FB and a fast QB who could also read it well. Specifically I was talking about ISV versus a 50 when you have a 5 tech DT and a DE outside him. So on ISV you tell your QB to (after getting a pull read) cut it up based on how the DE gets blocked? If the DE tries to crash down the TE would wash him down and the QB would pitch off the invert. If the DE works for contain the TE would drive him out, the QB would cut it up inside and still pitch off the invert. Is that what you are talking about?

Chuck,

All above is for the ISV, not the OSV as we do not block the EMOL (DE usually) in any fashion on the OSV.
Another coaching point your QB needs to be aware of: The rule of thumb for the veer reads is ALWAYS THE FIRST MAN OUTSIDE OF THE B HOLE IS YOUR READ. In a 50 front, that usually means the 4i-4-5 tech.
WHEN FACING A 4 LOOK, THE D LIKES TO WALK A LB UP IN THERE EVERY SO OFTEN BETWEEN THE DE AND THE B GAP. THEREFORE, THE LB NOW BECOMES THE DIVE READ!

JC

Chuck,

You want to remember now any DC worth his salt, when getting ready to face an option team, always asks himself first and foremost, WHO IS THEIR BEST RUNNER (QB-FB-RB) AND HOW DO WE KEEP THE BALL OUT OF HIS HANDS ALL NIGHT LONG??? If they know what they are doing, there first step will be TO KEEP IT OUT OF HIS HANDS BY FORMATION ( as we have already discussed here by alignment of the read man ) and then the implementation of their game plan to stop your best runner. The point of this post is to offer the suggestion that you HAVE A PLAN for when they take your best runner away from you on any given night. What has always worked for me is to make certain that the other two backs KNOW BEYOND A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT WHEN THIS HAPPENS, IT IS THERE CHANCE TO STEP UP AND SHINE AS THE D WILL BE CONCENTRATING ON THE "BEST" RUNNER. Just a suggestion, as always.

JC

Coach P--let me see if I understand you correctly. You release the TE to the alley player, leaving both the DT and DE unblocked. The QB upon pulling the ball will get on a track taking him upfield ASAP thus if the DE has no chance of slow playing the QB. If he does take him as you say the TB is gone.

We double read inside veer this past year!Only difference was we aiming point of FB.We dove him in the center/guard gap.This gave our QB an extra quarter of a second to read the DE.We also arc blocked our Slot/TE to the alley player.For a change up,we would loop the tackle out on the DE,and run a wider version of MIDLINE with the Slot leading up.Both worked well.

Yo Lou,

I guess so, who in there right mind is going to leave the guard uncovered on the strong side verses an option team? We always see a nose, a backside 4-5 and a 2, a frontside 3 and 7-6-9 with the LB walked up in a bubble over the playside guard. IF there DE is in a 7 they will cheat the monster up for outside contain, Mike has dive back all the way reading through the guards to him, Sam will read for crack on SS and scrape for perimeter control verses ISV.

Coach Easton

Pretty much, unless the defense decides to suddenly give us a 2 or 3 tech.
Yes, he would pitch off the EMLOS-- never, ever, ever pitch off the read key! Ever!
Yes, midline and veer is the same vs. a 50.
I stopped running outside veer b/c the footwork was too challenging-- for now!
The SPLIT BACK veer was designed to defeat the 50 defense.
www.coachwyatt.com/veerexplained.html

Chuck, read the article. It made a difference in my life.
Take care Chuck.

Lou, I remember that you were posting about that last year. No assignments, you just kept running right at the B gap? I sure would have also! What did your record end up being last year? How is it looking for this season? Did you get the coaches you needed?

Coach Easton

I have posted on the inside veer vs the 50 before - the teams we see will squeeze the tackle hard on the release of the OT and take dive - the DE has QB and they play pitch with the secondary - we have had some success with wide splits by the tackle but we forund our best scheme was to block the DE with the TE - we would start to reach the DE and if he widened we would lock on and turn him out, the QB would then have an alley off tackle. Last several years we have set a wing and folded the wing under the block of the TE - Midline concepts with ISV footwork. We like to see even fronts but see almost exclusively 5-2/5-3. Over the lst few years have not gooton to the pitch phase very much - need to get back to this part of the ISV - We a looking at the Midline triple as an answer to this.

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I have posted on the inside veer vs the 50 before - the teams we see will squeeze the tackle hard on the release of the OT and take dive - the DE has QB and they play pitch with the secondary - we have had some success with wide splits by the tackle but we forund our best scheme was to block the DE with the TE - we would start to reach the DE and if he widened we would lock on and turn him out, the QB would then have an alley off tackle.

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We used to call this scheme the TED option where the TE would turn out and teh QB would duck up inside of his block. It is a great short yardage play where you don't have to worry about getting the pitch off. I like the idea of bringing your wing underneath! If you have a runner at QB this is a simple way to get it done!

thanks for the post!

I have never been a splitback veer team. We have run it from splitbacks but also from the I formation. What advantage does splitbacks offer that running it from the I does not, and vice versa. Splitbacks seem to allow for more misdirection like the cutback play than the I does.

The best way to teach the veer is through the V. Draw a V from the fullback to the outside hips of both guards. Anything inside that V we block, the first down lineman outside the V is the read player and the next guy outside is the pitch. Our QB,lineman,etc. never have any problem on run the veer against any front.

Agreed! Kudos on the "V" teaching method. Anything you can do to simplifies things helps your kids and increases chances for success. Thanks very much!